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<blockquote data-quote="Digerati" data-source="post: 671841" data-attributes="member: 23832"><p>[USER=95751]@holdum333[/USER] - Yeah, I am not a fan of vacuums because of static. This is why professional repair facilities use compressed air instead. I agree there are "anti-static" vacuums designed for ESD sensitive electronics, but they are either <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Metro-Vacuum-DV3ESD1-DataVac-Anti-Static/dp/B000RMQJBK">too expensive</a> or not powerful enough, IMO.</p><p></p><p>You can use cans of compressed dusting gas, but I don't like them because contrary to their common name, it is not compressed "air" in those cans but hazardous gases like <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1,1-Difluoroethane">difluoroethane</a> which is actually a refrigerant and is highly dangerous if inhaled. In fact, in some jurisdictions, the purchase of these products is controlled like model glue and spray paint because addicts are "huffing" the stuff to get high! <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite9" alt=":eek:" title="Eek! :eek:" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":eek:" /> <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite3" alt=":(" title="Frown :(" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":(" /></p><p></p><p>And if you don't hold the cans level when spraying, they can spew extremely cold liquids - not good on fingers or hot electronics. That said, they are handy to quickly blast cookie crumbs out of a keyboard or a dog hair from in front of the light emitter in an optical/laser mouse.</p><p></p><p>If doing regular cleaning of electronics, I highly recommend "investing" in a decent <a href="http://www.homedepot.com/p/Husky-20-gal-Portable-Air-Compressor-F2S20VWD/203187354">air compressor</a>. Just make sure you use an <a href="http://www.homedepot.com/p/Campbell-Hausfeld-3-8-in-Filter-PA212103AV/203009773">inline moisture and particulate filter</a> to avoid spewing nasty, rusty, oily, contaminated water that has condensed and pooled in the tank. Note this compressor and filter cost considerably less than that vacuum and you can use the air compressor for all sorts of other things, like building a fence or painting your house. And the very first time you can pump up a flat tire so you can ease on down to the repair shop instead of having to swap in a spare, you will qualm any doubts you may have had for buying the air compressor in the first place. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /></p><p></p><p>Also, be sure to use a wooden Popsicle/glue stick to hold any fans stationary while blasting. This will allow for better cleaning, but also prevent overspinning the fan bearings.</p><p></p><p>When it is raining and I cannot lug a dirty system outside for blasting, I may use a vacuum. I just make sure I wrap my hand around the nozzle extending my index finger out first, then I plant that finger on bare metal of the case interior, then use a soft, natural fiber brush to stir up and direct the dust to the vacuum. Planting my finger first on the case metal discharges any static in my body and the nozzle and prevents the build up of any more static.</p><p></p><p>*****</p><p></p><p>[USER=96347]@William B[/USER] - you can follow the link in my sig to see if I am the one in need of a lesson.</p><p></p><p>First, you are now trying to justify the myth by changing your story. You initially claimed the TIM may need to be replaced simply because it was a year or two old and has caked and dried out. I specifically said you don't have to replace TIM just because years passed by and I provided a link to support my claim.</p><p></p><p>I ask,</p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px">Where does Intel say TIM needs regular replacing?</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Where does AMD say TIM needs regular replacing?</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Where does NVIDIA say TIM needs regular replacing?</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Where does ANY notebook or PC maker say TIM needs regular replacing?</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Where does ANY TIM maker say TIM needs regular replacing?</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Where does ANY aftermarket cooler maker say TIM needs regular replacing?</p><p></p><p>The answer to all those questions is, "no where!"</p><p></p><p>OF COURSE good transfer of heat requires the TIM was properly applied in the first place. So your comment about too much or too little is just obfuscation. If the CPU was not properly seated, it would not work so that is just more obfuscation. And yes, there are other scenarios that can occur that may require TIM be replaced. Extreme temperatures and/or high humidity may contribute to "pump-out" problems - and of course abuse (twisting the heatsink, or rough handling) may break the bond. But my reply was in response to your claim TIM may dry out in as little as a year or two and need replacing because it has caked up and dried out.</p><p></p><p>There is a <strong>common misconception</strong> among enthusiasts who are not formally trained in electronics that because the "exposed" edges of TIM turns hard or becomes "crusty" that the product between the mating surfaces has somehow become ineffective. THAT IS NOT TRUE! Remember, the most efficient transfer of heat occurs with direct metal-to-metal contact of the mating surfaces. So "caked" and dried TIM around the edges is not a problem. It is between the mating surfaces that matters. And as I said, as long as that bond is not broken, you don't need to risk destroying the processor through ESD/mishandling.</p><p></p><p>As for seeing a drop in temps after replacing the TIM, a few degrees can be expected when replacing OEM or generic TIM with a high-end TIM. But if you need those few degrees to prevent an unstable or throttling down situation, you have other problems - like <strong>inadequate case cooling</strong> and/or excessive dust build-up.</p><p></p><p>And typically when a person takes the time to disassemble or open up a computer to replace the TIM, they do more than simply replace the TIM. They also clean out the dust.</p><p></p><p>So off the high horse attitude with condescending "big chief" and "lesson giving" personal commentary and show us where ANY manufacturer of processors, TIM or computers claim that TIM needs regular replacing because it is a couple years old. If you can't, then there's YOUR lesson.</p><p></p><p>And just be clear - did I say TIM never needs replacing? NO! I said it does not need replacing just because it is a "year or two" old and dried out.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Digerati, post: 671841, member: 23832"] [USER=95751]@holdum333[/USER] - Yeah, I am not a fan of vacuums because of static. This is why professional repair facilities use compressed air instead. I agree there are "anti-static" vacuums designed for ESD sensitive electronics, but they are either [URL='http://www.amazon.com/Metro-Vacuum-DV3ESD1-DataVac-Anti-Static/dp/B000RMQJBK']too expensive[/URL] or not powerful enough, IMO. You can use cans of compressed dusting gas, but I don't like them because contrary to their common name, it is not compressed "air" in those cans but hazardous gases like [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1,1-Difluoroethane']difluoroethane[/URL] which is actually a refrigerant and is highly dangerous if inhaled. In fact, in some jurisdictions, the purchase of these products is controlled like model glue and spray paint because addicts are "huffing" the stuff to get high! :eek: :( And if you don't hold the cans level when spraying, they can spew extremely cold liquids - not good on fingers or hot electronics. That said, they are handy to quickly blast cookie crumbs out of a keyboard or a dog hair from in front of the light emitter in an optical/laser mouse. If doing regular cleaning of electronics, I highly recommend "investing" in a decent [URL='http://www.homedepot.com/p/Husky-20-gal-Portable-Air-Compressor-F2S20VWD/203187354']air compressor[/URL]. Just make sure you use an [URL='http://www.homedepot.com/p/Campbell-Hausfeld-3-8-in-Filter-PA212103AV/203009773']inline moisture and particulate filter[/URL] to avoid spewing nasty, rusty, oily, contaminated water that has condensed and pooled in the tank. Note this compressor and filter cost considerably less than that vacuum and you can use the air compressor for all sorts of other things, like building a fence or painting your house. And the very first time you can pump up a flat tire so you can ease on down to the repair shop instead of having to swap in a spare, you will qualm any doubts you may have had for buying the air compressor in the first place. ;) Also, be sure to use a wooden Popsicle/glue stick to hold any fans stationary while blasting. This will allow for better cleaning, but also prevent overspinning the fan bearings. When it is raining and I cannot lug a dirty system outside for blasting, I may use a vacuum. I just make sure I wrap my hand around the nozzle extending my index finger out first, then I plant that finger on bare metal of the case interior, then use a soft, natural fiber brush to stir up and direct the dust to the vacuum. Planting my finger first on the case metal discharges any static in my body and the nozzle and prevents the build up of any more static. ***** [USER=96347]@William B[/USER] - you can follow the link in my sig to see if I am the one in need of a lesson. First, you are now trying to justify the myth by changing your story. You initially claimed the TIM may need to be replaced simply because it was a year or two old and has caked and dried out. I specifically said you don't have to replace TIM just because years passed by and I provided a link to support my claim. I ask, [INDENT]Where does Intel say TIM needs regular replacing? Where does AMD say TIM needs regular replacing? Where does NVIDIA say TIM needs regular replacing? Where does ANY notebook or PC maker say TIM needs regular replacing? Where does ANY TIM maker say TIM needs regular replacing? Where does ANY aftermarket cooler maker say TIM needs regular replacing?[/INDENT] The answer to all those questions is, "no where!" OF COURSE good transfer of heat requires the TIM was properly applied in the first place. So your comment about too much or too little is just obfuscation. If the CPU was not properly seated, it would not work so that is just more obfuscation. And yes, there are other scenarios that can occur that may require TIM be replaced. Extreme temperatures and/or high humidity may contribute to "pump-out" problems - and of course abuse (twisting the heatsink, or rough handling) may break the bond. But my reply was in response to your claim TIM may dry out in as little as a year or two and need replacing because it has caked up and dried out. There is a [B]common misconception[/B] among enthusiasts who are not formally trained in electronics that because the "exposed" edges of TIM turns hard or becomes "crusty" that the product between the mating surfaces has somehow become ineffective. THAT IS NOT TRUE! Remember, the most efficient transfer of heat occurs with direct metal-to-metal contact of the mating surfaces. So "caked" and dried TIM around the edges is not a problem. It is between the mating surfaces that matters. And as I said, as long as that bond is not broken, you don't need to risk destroying the processor through ESD/mishandling. As for seeing a drop in temps after replacing the TIM, a few degrees can be expected when replacing OEM or generic TIM with a high-end TIM. But if you need those few degrees to prevent an unstable or throttling down situation, you have other problems - like [B]inadequate case cooling[/B] and/or excessive dust build-up. And typically when a person takes the time to disassemble or open up a computer to replace the TIM, they do more than simply replace the TIM. They also clean out the dust. So off the high horse attitude with condescending "big chief" and "lesson giving" personal commentary and show us where ANY manufacturer of processors, TIM or computers claim that TIM needs regular replacing because it is a couple years old. If you can't, then there's YOUR lesson. And just be clear - did I say TIM never needs replacing? NO! I said it does not need replacing just because it is a "year or two" old and dried out. [/QUOTE]
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