Computers are still too hard to use!

Discussion in 'Windows 7 Help and Support' started by MikeHawthorne, Nov 15, 2011.

  1. Andrea Borman

    Andrea Borman Honorable Member

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    Well,my first experience a computer was in an Internet cafe. I used to use Internet cafes, and there they have Windows XP. And then last April 2010, I got my first home computer,a Windows 7 netbook.

    But because before that,I used Internet cafes where they put their own start and desktop wallpaper themes on their computers. When I got my Windows 7 netbook I did not think anything of the default Aero theme. As at that time I did not even know there were different versions of Windows,Windows XP,Windows Vista,Windows 7. Until I started using my laptop at home.

    But because Windows 7 has a start menu,taskbar and normal desktop with icons,I had no trouble using it. But if my first laptop had been Windows 8,I would not have known what to do. And probably I would not have been able to figure out how to use it.

    Then this year in July 2011, I bought the very last 2 Windows XP netbooks in the store that were brand new. And I find both Windows XP and Windows 7 great to use.

    I bought recently second hand Windows Vista laptop but my experience with that has not been good. It had Windows Vista Home Premium with no service packs installed. So it must be an old laptop made in 2007. When Windows Vista first came out. As the first service did not come out until 2008. And now you must have Service Pack 2 to get updates in Windows Vista now,I read.

    But I found Windows Vista very very slow. It took 3 hours to install the first time updates,over 100 of them. And now that laptop is broken.

    And I found out from the computer repair man that it is not worth repairing. But he also told me that Windows Vista has a lot of bugs that were never fixed. And other people have had problems with Windows Vista. And it is very slow and nothing like Windows 7 or Windows XP.

    I found that out the hard way. After I tried it myself.

    But it could be the laptop. So maybe Windows Vista could run better on a new laptop. But I do not know. But I have spoken to some friends. And they say that Windows Vista is slow and not fast like Windows 7 or Windows XP.

    But I think Windows 8 will be worse, because of the Metro tiles and no start menu.And the Metro theme is also very ugly, as well as being difficult to use.I have never used it, but I have seen Windows 8 on the web.

    I think that we should not give up our Windows 7 for Windows 8. We are better off on Windows 7 or Windows XP or both if you still have Windows XP.

    But Windows Vista? That does not seem so good from my experience anyway.

    But I don't want to go on Windows 8 the way it is. And what does UI mean?

    And I think in England we should have a choice about what version of Windows we use.

    Because now in England,you can no longer buy Windows XP or Windows Vista laptops. As most shops and stores are only selling Windows 7. Unless you go to a second hand store or a shop that sells reconditioned laptops.

    That is why I am stocking up on laptops now. So I will not be forced to buy Windows 8 in the future,if they stop selling Windows 7. Which is my worst nightmare.Andrea Borman.
     
  2. whs

    whs Extraordinary Member

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    I kind of disagree with the notion that PCs are too complex. I am 74 and I got my first PC in 2007 - now I have 6 (I have several homes). They all run perfectly. Since 2 years I am an instructor in a very large computer club and I teach advanced Windows classes. Nobody taught me and I was perfectly able to master the problems by myself.

    Yes it takes a bit of patience and concentration - and a good eyesight which is my biggest problem. But it is doable. People, especially older people, should not be discouraged to dive into the adventure. Throw them into the water and they will have to swim. Holding their hand all the time is no good - but some initial basic instruction is useful. They must be curious themselves and try things out.

    In my classes I do not really teach how to do things but how you can find out how to do things. That gives me a lot more milage than boring them with bits and bytes.
     
  3. Andrea Borman

    Andrea Borman Honorable Member

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    Yes,I read that back in 2007,that was when Windows Vista first came out. So was your first PC Windows Vista by any chance?

    I bought a second hand Windows Vista laptop a few weeks ago. But that proved to be a big mistake,as I found Windows Vista to be very slow. It took over 3 hours to install the first time updates,over 100 of them. And then the laptop stopped working. And then the computer engineer in the repair shop said,it was not worth repairing. As the hard drive repair would cost as much as what I paid for the laptop.

    Is Windows Vista really that slow or was I just unlucky and bought the wrong laptop? Andrea Borman.
     
  4. whs

    whs Extraordinary Member

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    Yes, I started with Vista on it's first day (Febr. 1, 2007). It was a modest laptop, so performance was not as swift as on some of the recent systems. But 100 updates in 3 hours is not unusual, especially if you have a slow internet connection.

    What is your problem. If the HDD died, that is not very expensive to repair. Although disks are currently exceptionally expensive (because of the flood in Thailand), you should be able to find one for about $70.

    Is there something we can do for you. What are the symptons of your laptop trouble.


    Vista was slower than e.g. Windows 7, but on a midrange system like my desktop I never had a problem. My wife is still using Vista on 2 laptops that are from 2007, but the OS runs off SSDs and that makes all the difference.
     
  5. Andrea Borman

    Andrea Borman Honorable Member

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    Oh no.It's not my Internet connection that is the problem.I have a very fast Internet connection and my monthly package that I pay for includes unlimited downloads. So it is not that.

    I also have Windows 7 netbooks and Windows XP netbooks. And both windows XP and Windows 7 are fast. Windows XP being slightly faster than Windows 7.

    But Windows Vista was slow. As for the Windows Vista laptop. I bought it from a shop that sells second hand laptops. Because in England you can now no longer buy Windows XP or Windows Vista,only Windows 7. Unless you buy second hand or reconditioned laptops.

    So I bought the second hand laptop an HP Pavilion DV 9000 that had Windows Vista Home Premium, but NO service packs installed. So that laptop must have been made in 2006 or 2007 when Windows Vista first came out. As service pack 1 never came in until 2008.

    But Windows Vista on that laptop was very very slow. Updates took over 3 hours to install. And then the hard drive crashed. And I got the blue screen of death. And I had only had the laptop for 3 days. But the shop would not give me my money back or change the laptop for another one. As they said they could not sell it,with the blue screen of death.

    And when I took to another place for repair, it was then I found out from the repair man.That the hard drive had gone, and it was faulty when I bought it. He could have repaired it, but it would have cost as much as for what I paid for it. I paid £200 pounds and to put in a new hard drive and reinstall Windows would cost me £150 pounds. And he told me he could reinstall Windows Vista and activate it with the existing product key on the laptop. But I would not have a recovery partition, and I would have to create a recovery disk myself. Which I do not know how to do.

    So if I needed to do a factory restore in the future,I would have to take it in to the repair centre. And he would have to reinstall Windows for me. As Windows would be installed on a new hard disk with no recovery partition.

    So I told him, forget it, and did not have it repaired.And I was told for what it would cost me,it was not worth repairing. But the repair man also told me that Windows Vista has a lot of bugs that were never fixed.

    So just because Windows Vista looks like Windows 7,does not mean it is like Windows 7. It is not. I found out the hard way. But Windows 7 is fast and so is Windows XP.

    But since then, I have read the web, and talked to other people, and they have also had problems with Windows Vista. Andrea Borman.
     
  6. OldTimer

    OldTimer Banned

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    When Vizduh first came out, I set about searching the World Wide Web for tips on how to tweak it and tune it for optimum performance.
    Now I can beat it down to size like any other OS, to get it to perform well.
    One great tweak is to install the "Classic Shell" and then install "Grant Full Admin Control" and turn off UAC. Then it begins to act like a real OS, and is really User Friendly for the home user. :tongue:
    I have many customer's who use Vizduh and I've learned to make it much more friendly and useful for them.

    Typically, Win-7 does run faster than V. and Win-8 runs still faster yet.

    Many of the performance Tweaks that I've used for years on XP, also work on Vizduh and Win-7, even Win-8/DP/64.

    XP is still my daily driver, but I'm running Win-8/DP/64 on a six year old Compaq desktop with a single core CPU and just 2 gig's of DDR ram.
    I did put in a new SATA II hard drive for a little better performance. Compaq had only put an 80 gig IDE drive in that PC and only 512 megs of ram. Cheeech!

    You're not having fun yet, till you're running Win-8. Have a GO at it Mates!

    Merry Christmas!
    :cool:
     
  7. whs

    whs Extraordinary Member

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    Andrea, That does not sound right. A new disk should not be so expensive - maybe 50 quid. I am not really familiar with the UK prices, but look around. You probably do not need a very large disk - maybe 160 to 250GBs.

    And installing Vista is possible with any Vista installation disc with the same edition (e.g. Home Premium) as your COA sticker on the bottom of the laptop.

    Once installed, you make images with e.g. free Macrium of free Paragon. That is a lot better than any installation disc. And make new images periodically so that you are always up-to-date for your fall-backs and do not have to reinstall a gezillion updates. A system restore from an image takes 20 to 30 minutes. Beats any reinstall.
     
  8. Andrea Borman

    Andrea Borman Honorable Member

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    Well the repair man would not have just had to put in the new hard disk. He would also have had to reinstall Windows Vista and activate it with the product key. But as it was a second hand laptop,it only came with the battery and the charger. And although it had a DVD drive,it did not even come with any recovery disks. And it did not come with a Windows CD either.

    But it had the recovery partition on D drive. But then the hard disk went. And so if the computer engineer had replaced the hard disk with a new one. The new hard disk would have been reinstalled with Windows Vista but no recovery partition.The engineer told me I had to create my own recovery disk myself. Which I do not know how to do.

    So it was not worth repairing because of the cost and that I would have no recovery partition. So I would have not been able to restore to factory condition if something went wrong with Windows.

    Normally,if something goes wrong,that cannot be fixed.I just press the F11 or F10 key depending on the laptop and it does the factory restore for me.Otherwise known as System Recovery. That's the only way I know how to reinstall Windows. And I told the repair man I don't know how to reinstall operating systems or create recovery disks or install operating systems.

    But because the laptop was not worth repairing or at least it could not be used by me or anyone else. The repair man has taken it apart for spare parts. So I don't have the laptop now.Andrea Borman.
     
  9. OldTimer

    OldTimer Banned

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    The so-called technician was blowing smoke up your skirt. It's really not that difficult at all.
    When you learn more about computers, you'll see I was right.
    The knowledgeable play while the uninformed pay. Eh?

    :cool:
     
  10. whs

    whs Extraordinary Member

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    Andrea, This is all blown out of proportion. If you can find a reasonably priced disc, all you need to do is to borrow a Vista installation disk (maybe even from the repair man), install Vista and apply the product key from the COA sticker that is on the bottom of the laptop. This is really not a big deal. And replacing the disk is easy too (4 screws to handle). There are plenty of videos on the web that show you how to do that.

    And since editing the previous post does not work for some reason, here my additional comment:

    And once you are all installed, you make images with one of the free imaging programs and you will never need an installation disc again.

    The Ghost imaging program that Old Timer recommends is OK too, but it costs money. There is no need to spend that because especially free Macrium is a lot easier to use, a lot faster and works perfectly well. In more than 50 restore operations I have never had a problem.
     
  11. OldTimer

    OldTimer Banned

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    Actually the version of Ghost that I use (Ghost 11.5, DOS version) is not sold anymore by Symantec. It's the last DOS version that was made and only runs from a DOS boot disk.
    Any good backup software is also the Restore software, so it MUST NOT be installed on the hard drive. When the hard drive goes up in smoke, your backup and your restore program go up in smoke with it. Eh? How sensible is that?

    I played around with Acronis True Image some but as soon as I installed it on the HD, I used it to make the recovery CD and then I deleted it off of the HD. It runs just fine for both Backup and Restore right from the CD. That's the only sensible way to run a backup system. And, make several copies of that CD, just for safety sake.

    But yeah, if you have your entire C: drive backed up to some external media, you never have to reinstall Windows from scratch, ever again. That's a service I provide for my customers when I set up a new PC.

    I can do a Ghost restore on my PC from a second HD in less than 10 minutes. From DVD, takes a bit longer. :)
    Just a few nights ago, I backed up my C: drive, using Ghost 11.5 in Full Compression mode, to three DVD's. Ghost put itself on the first DVD making it a Ghost Boot Disk. Those DVD's will go in a Fireproof SAFE, some miles away.

    Read my signature line! and Merry Christmas Everyone,

    Old Timer :cool:
     
  12. whs

    whs Extraordinary Member

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    This was the fastest image I have done for the complete C partition - from an SSD to an internal HDD.

    View attachment 17575
     
  13. Andrea Borman

    Andrea Borman Honorable Member

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    Well the place where I took the laptop into was Carphone Warehouse,The Geek Squad. I think they have Carphone Warehouse in the USA as well,where you are. That's where I went to.

    So did I take the laptop to the right place or the wrong place? Andrea Borman.
     
  14. whs

    whs Extraordinary Member

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    You need not take it to any place. Just do what we are trying to tell you. Fixing it is no rocket science.
     
  15. Andrea Borman

    Andrea Borman Honorable Member

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    Well I don't have the skill to repair my computer by opening it up and taking out the hard drive. And replacing it. It's like asking me to open up my television set and repair it,if it was broken.

    I don't know how to open up and repair my computer, any more than I know how to repair my gas boiler or TV set.

    I and most people just do not have that kind of skill. Andrea Borman.
     
  16. whs

    whs Extraordinary Member

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  17. OldTimer

    OldTimer Banned

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    We don't have such a Warehouse store here, but the "Geek Squad" inhabits "Best Buy" stores here and they are the laughing stock of the technical industry. The ONE word they seem to understand best is "Format" and number two it "RE-Install".
    As for fixing anything....Good Luck! They are a bunch of geeky kids who couldn't even write an Autoexec.bat file if their skinny little butts depended on it.

    I'd have to say, if you can't do a simple little thing to your PC, then maybe you should take up knitting or something and leave the computers alone.

    I've been a professional Electronics/Computer technician for the past 47 years. I've run my own computer business for 31 of those years. Changing out a hard drive on a laptop is technically on a level with changing the batteries in a flashlight.
    But if you're technically challenged, you'd just as well leave it alone.
    Many private shops would have a small, used hard drive laying around, because they swap them out for bigger ones for people who think they need more space, (for their junk). You could probably snag a used HD for about $20 to $30 USD.
    That's what I sell them for here.

    Excuse me but I'm setting up a new Toshiba Laptop for a friend and I need to get back to it. I just finished partitioning the hard drive and I'm now doing a Ghost backup.

    Happy Holidays!

    :cool:
     
  18. Andrea Borman

    Andrea Borman Honorable Member

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    So you do have Carphone Warehouse in America. They have stores all over England here, where I live. Take a look at their site here-Geek Squad - Carphone Warehouse Help

    But the service is not all that good. But don't tell them I said so. Andrea Borman.
     
  19. OldTimer

    OldTimer Banned

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    Ha Ha the link doesn't work any better than the Geek Squad.

    Both are Worthless!

    :cool:
     
  20. Andrea Borman

    Andrea Borman Honorable Member

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