New drive clean install W7 and XP what's the best way?

Discussion in 'Windows 7 Installation' started by Ivone, Feb 20, 2009.

  1. jsilophi

    jsilophi New Member

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    i have to experience trouble before actually reading this :D

    anyway, i think there is only one way to dual boot xp and win7. and that is to prepare 2 separate ntfs partitions for the os and make them both primary. first drive is the active drive of course. installing xp on the active primary and win7 on the other primary partition. the boot loader is automatically configured by the win7 installation and puts it in the xp partition since it is the active one.

    just some fyi: win7 creates a 200mb hidden partition separate from the os partition if you are installing win7 only on one hard drive and not dual boot it. for the dual boot scenario, the data in the 200mb hidden partition is stored in the xp partition.
     
  2. Ivone

    Ivone Senior Member

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    Well, that's a good one.
    I start to play with the idea to use a second hard drive or other pc unit to test Win7. Specialy after this news of 200MB hidden info.

    Then once proven and working fine, install it on the main pc.

    Anyway, I have made all the partition and ready for W7, but I am still thinking about the best option.
     
  3. anykey

    anykey Honorable Member

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    Ha ha, that's just what I did, Ivone. I have no regrets. Hope it works for you too.
     
  4. greenarrow1

    greenarrow1 New Member

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    Dual Booting OS's

    The best way to go is with 2 hard drives if one can afford 2. The reason is to use a 3d party boot manager which means if 1 OS goes south it will not take down the other boot manager or if the windows boot manager gets corrupted you can still boot without going nutso.

    Using 2 hard drives gives you options as to the ways you want to go and if wanted you can actually use 2 window boot managers. This is the best option if one does testing of Beta or RC's for operating systems since when the testing is over you can uninstall the test system without affecting the other OS or if by chance they give you a free license and upgrade you can merge to a one boot manager for both OS's.

    Either way you go remember it is important to create an emergency boot disc which will save you a head ache down the road and always back up the data you deem important or irreplaceable.
     
  5. djwayne

    djwayne New Member

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    I also use separate hard drives for different Operating Systems, because I want a failsafe way of keeping my OS's operating. If one goes down, I can plug in the other and be back in business in about two minutes. Funny thing though, they rarely go down.

    Partitions look good on paper, but they can become corrupted fairly easily.


    :)
     
  6. dockmaster

    dockmaster New Member

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    correct me if I'm wrong, but 2 hard drives, with a OS on each OS's = 2 seperate virus programs (Avira), 2 seperate mail programs (Thunderbird), 2 seperate browsers(Firefox) 2 seperate AOL's (for wife!!) and basically, 2 seperate everything.
    I installed XP first and it can see the win7 drive, but not visa versa.......
     
  7. djwayne

    djwayne New Member

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    I actually have three hard drives set up. One with XP Service Pack 3, a second drive with Vista Service Pack 1, and a third drive with Windows 7 Beta on it. This is so I can go back and forth to compared the previous Windows versions with the new Windows 7.

    Microsoft warned about crashes with the beta of W7, so keeping it isolated from the other drives makes sense to me.

    I have IE8 and Firefox 2 setup on all three drives. I'm using AVG Free on two drives and NOD 32 on the other.

    I have no problems accessing my mail from any of the drives.

    I keep most of my programs and files on the XP drive, but I also have older versions of my programs on all three drives.

    It takes a while to set it all up, but once it's done, it's great.
     
    #27 djwayne, Feb 24, 2009
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2009
  8. greenarrow1

    greenarrow1 New Member

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    2 Hard Drives and emails, etc

    You sign into email and aol or what ever and it does not matter what operating system you are using. As far as bookmarks and favorites import them from the other drive. I did not say hide the drive but create the other OS on it and use a 3d party boot loader. I use both OpenSUSE and SLES and can read all emails I have on them plus on windows. Even if you partition you still have 2 or more browsers because you are using another OS. Easiest way MS should go is to produce Live CD's of their Betas and RC's for testing as that way you would not even have to load it on your machines. The other thing is when u purchase security software the license state 1 computer not how many OS's on the computer. You are testing a OS that will expire so you should not be buying software for it. People are strange as they sometimes change their minds and you might one day just decide not to keep Windows 7 even if you like it now.

    What I am trying to point out is when it comes time for you to uninstall Windows7 you will lose your other MBR and will have to reinstall it from your disc. If one does have 2 or more hard drives it is so much easier to install betas or testing OS on it and not disturb your original OS or its boot program.
     
    #28 greenarrow1, Feb 24, 2009
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2009
  9. Kyle

    Kyle New Member

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    Just a comment, slightly off topic, but I must say some people go way too far, and do such crazy things I'll never understand with computers. Just reading this topic makes me laugh, no offense to anyone, but some things are just... beyond my reasoning. For example; djwayne, you unplug hard drives to separate Windows 7 from your other OS' so it doesn't crash them? That doesn't even make sense. You can't have an OS take out another OS, unless you go onto the other drive and delete sh!t you're not supposed to. If Windows 7 just up and crashed, the computer doesn't just go 'well, Windows 7 isn't loading, so I'm not loading these completely separate entities either. It's like saying if three people are standing in a room and one has a brain aneurysm, they all die. It's completely impossible.
     
    Radenight and (deleted member) like this.
  10. djwayne

    djwayne New Member

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    Apparently you lack the experience of having a partitioned hard drive getting corrupted. It's very easy to lose partitions. I know, I've done it. !!
    Like I said, partitions look good on paper, but they are not Fail Safe !!!!

    That's the great thing about computers, you can set them up anyway you want.

    The bad thing about computers is that they can have a mind of their own, and do unexpected things when you least expect it.

    You do yours your way, and I'll do mine my way.

    :)
     
  11. Radenight

    Radenight New Member

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    Very well put Kyle! :) I agree with that 100%...
     
  12. djwayne

    djwayne New Member

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    Here's my response, just in case you missed it.

    ***************************************************************************************

    Another thing to think about is, let's say I did it your way, and put three partitions on my hard drive and a different OS on each partition. Then after a month or two, the hard drive itself fails. Then I would lose all three os's that were on that one drive.

    Doing it my way, if one of my three drives fail, I still have two others I can boot up to in a minute or two.

    All my important files are backed up outside the computer, so that isn't a concern to me.

    :)
     
    #32 djwayne, Feb 25, 2009
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2009
  13. Kyle

    Kyle New Member

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    ... you DO know that you can install Windows to separate hard drives without having to unplug them, and it works the exact same way as partitioning without the risk right? Also, I've been working with computers since the day Windows 95 hit the general public, and have never once had a partition error out, corrupt, or do anything that harmed another partition other than the one I was using.
     
  14. djwayne

    djwayne New Member

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    Of course I know I can plug in more than one drive, but I don't want to, especially while working with a beta program. I have had it happen where I had two drives plugged in and went to re-install an os on one but both drives got formatted during the process, destroying all my files on the drive I wasn't planning on re-formatting. So to alleviate this problem, I make it a habit to keep my drives isolated, and only use one drive at a time, ESPECIALLY when installing a new OS.

    All that has to happen is your file system gets corrupted and you lose everything on that disk. All you need to have happen is a mechanical problem with your hard drive and you're out of business...You've never heard of a hard drive failing ??

    Another consideration is viruses on a hard drive, can hide out in your memory and infect any drive connected to it. I had one virus that would jump back and forth between hard disk and memory each time I'd try to uninstall it. It was a real bugger to get rid of. The anit-virus company explained it this way, "Trying to get rid of this virus is like trying to catch a monkey who keeps jumping back and forth on two trees. You chase him up one tree, and he jumps to another."


    :)
     
    #34 djwayne, Feb 25, 2009
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2009
  15. jimbo45

    jimbo45 New Member

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    C'mon Guys -- unless you are a HEAVY torrent user and downloading a lot of music, games, video from dubious sources who genuinely has had a Virus on a HOME (not a WORK) computer. Some might but I'd almost bet (unless this board is exclusively populated by people under 19 years opf age -- which thank goodness it doesn't appear to be at all) a million US Dollars to a bucket full of "the brown stuff" that you could probably count the numbers who have had Computer Viruses on one hand --and it's likely to be their own fault.

    Why don't people just backup image their partitions --even a 45 GB partition can be imaged (or restored) in around 45 minutes on quite modest hardware.

    To install OS'es because you "might Break hard disks" is just totally and 100% PURE BOVINE SCATOLOGY.

    Just take backups --doesn't take long and saves you "LOADSTROUBLE"'.

    Cheers

    jimbo
     
  16. djwayne

    djwayne New Member

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    I don't use torrents or download music, but I do have a young friend who also uses my computer and downloads a lot of games. So I have to be careful about viruses. And yes I have had viruses on my computer that I have no idea how they got there. Browser hacks used to be a poplular thing with hackers. I haven't had any viruses in the last few years, but I did get them once in awhile years ago, so this is why I am concerned about them.

    If I backed up my current drives, I'd have a total of 6 drives. As I'd still want to keep them seperate.


    I still haven't heard one good arguement for having partitions. All my programs seem to be working just fine on the one big partition I have. I just don't feel the need to have programs on one, and data on another.

    :)
     
  17. jimbo45

    jimbo45 New Member

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    Hi there

    You obviously then don't use your computer to generate income.

    If I've been shooting say a Wedding and am processing files on the computers hard disk (believe me Photoshopping say 500 pictures to a professional standard is a LOT OF WORK) and I suddenly for one reason or another get an OS failure which causes me to re-install the OS -- then I've lost all the hard work I've done on the pictures -- which might not be able to be done again-- that's if I've even got copies of the pictures since the Camera cards will most likely have been used again for other shoots.

    Putting data on a separate disk area to the OS is always a good idea --the chances of an entire disk going bang are very small with modern hardware over the typical lifetime of a computer if its not mistreated.

    In any case backup is not only necessary for data on a computer -- I wouldn't even THINK of going out on a shooting gig without at least one spare backup camera either -- and I don't think you'll find any other pro shooter who would think any differently.

    And please before you say back up pictures to DVD's --- Most PRO cameras (and I'm talking PRO digital SLR's with those long white lenses etc) take a single picture of up to 24 MP in a RAW lossless comppressed file format -- so that's only around 200 pictures (or about 7 rolls of film in the "Old days" ) per DVD. (MP = Mega Pixel -- so 1 picture is 24 Megabytes). Shooting say sports you would shoot in bursts of around 10 - 20 pictures a time to capture the shot. You couldn't do that very satisfactorily with the old film cameras BTW. A sports shooter might shoot 5,000 pictures in a short time.

    A decently busy Wedding or Photo Journalist can easily take 1000 or more shots a week

    Of course not all this stuff would be used -this is why you edit the stuff afterwards.

    After de-compressing and "prepping" the pictures for printing say at A4 or even larger at A3 you are talking here of very large files. No way DVD's are "fit for purpose" as backup any more.

    Wait till you've lost some important data because you failed to back something up --- if it's a tax return you could even get serious jail time if this stuff isn't filled in correctly and submitted on time.

    I'm not trying to be nasty or anything but running a PRO business is very different from a home user who can simply say OK what does it matter if I need to re-format the disk etc. The DATA on most of our machines is very many more times more valuable than the computers themselves.

    Cheers
    jimbo
     
    #37 jimbo45, Feb 25, 2009
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2009
  18. djwayne

    djwayne New Member

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    I use my computer for music recording and production. I also have to work with large files. But I do back up things to media outside of the computer, so if there is a crash, I'm covered.
    There's nothing worse than a computer crash in the middle of a recording session. You have to get back up and running in a matter of minutes, hence the need for back up drives. I don't have time to mess around loading an image.

    In the music production business it's said that you haven't recorded anything until you've backed it up.

    You do what works for you, and I'll do what works for me, and let's keep the personal attacks down to a minimum.
     
  19. Kyle

    Kyle New Member

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    Actually, I've never had a hard drive fail. Ever. I have 2 and 4 GB drives back from my P100 that're running in other's PCs and they're still going (They run linux now, and are just used for net surfing but still... they haven't died in 14 years)

    As for Viruses, haven't had one in probably 8-10 years, so I can't say that I've chases one across hard drives. Also, there's an easy fix for that; it's called scan the whole computer instead of just your C-drive. I've never seen a virus 'hide' when a whole system scan has been completed.

    As for the fact that you wiped 2 hard drives instead of one in an OS install, that's your fault, not the computer's. If you can't give it the proper instructions then it can't complete the proper tasks. A computer can only do what it's told.
     
  20. djwayne

    djwayne New Member

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    I've had all these experiences. So whatever dude, like I said, you do it your way, I'll do it mine.
     

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